The volume adjustment is strange.

Blackbandt

Mikescotland Ah, I had read about it but didn't know that's what it meant.

That's not ideal, of course. I've never gone louder than 20 before, as it doesn't feel right. Will the problem still occur if I install an amplifier, etc.?

Could the Dudu team please change this? It's really very strange and not what one is used to.

@DUDU-Meng @dudu-lai @DUDU-HUANG @dudu-langzi

Could you please fix this problem with an update? Like I said, it just feels wrong. Especially since I often drive other cars where the volume control works normally. When I get back into my car, it feels wrong and I think every time that something is broken. Because in all other cars, volume level 20 is already really loud. Even Joying, Xomax, and whatever the other Android radios are called, don't do it like the Dudu.

Please, please change it.

PS: @Mikescotland From what I gather, you also use amplifiers. I'd like to connect my Helix DSP Mini Mk2 and an Audison SR 4500 power amplifier to the dudu soon. I'll be connecting the DSP via optical cable. Can you give me some tips on what level of dB I can check at which tone I'd start clipping? I have a mini oscilloscope and usually set the levels of my power amplifiers at -5 or -10 dB. How do I do that with the Dudu?

I've always done it like this with my Alpine or Pioneer radios. Of course, via RCA.

Tmt and Ht 1kHz and 0db were played on the radio and checked at the RCA to see when clipping occurs. And if I remember correctly, I also set the subwoofer to 0dB at 40Hz and checked when it clipped at the RCA input of the radio using an oscilloscope.

I only use TOSLINK with Dudu. How do I do that?

Mikescotland

Blackbandt with amplifiers it's even more annoying.
Let's say you have a 100 W amplifier. With linear volume control you're getting, like it says, linear, so 0 is 0W but 4 on the scale is already 4 watts pumped to your speakers. So, 5 is too loud when normal driving and 3 is too quiet. So you're left with very crude values, 4. And that's it. I've got 300W total power for front mid bass, so I am extremely unhappy with this.
In logarithmic adjustment, whole first half of adjustment (I'm generalising) regulates very finely, and then the last few values high, they actually double the volume. And that's how actually all audio devices work, except for... Dudu!

I haven't measured Dudu before clipping yet after the updates (previous was 0dBfs was like -6 dBfs on spdif in "passthrough" mode, now it is higher but still I don't think it's 0dBfs = 0dBfs). In a nutshell, with spdif passthrough Dudu doesn't clip at all even if you feed it 0dBfs.
If you plan using RCA (which I hope you're not planning to), it may be different. But since you have a nice dsp etc I suppose you'll comment it via spdif (passthrough mode), it won't clip at any level.

rmirage

The same problem exists with an amplifier.

Blackbandt

rmirage That's not what I wanted to hear. For me, someone who comes from the hi-fi world and loves music, the way it is with the Dudu is a disaster.

Blackbandt

Mikescotland Thanks for the explanation. And yes, I also read about the linear aspect. And that really annoys me.

No, I don't want to connect via RCA. That was just an example. I want to connect via optical, i.e., Toslink.

As I understand it, I therefore don't need to measure whether the radio is clipping, since it doesn't do that via TOSLINK. That's at least some good news.

abidali

Mikescotland That was the case in previous 3.5 update, I measured the RCA using oscilloscope and it was 2v at 29/36 and then last 7 points add 2.6v making it a total of 4.6v. Although unclipped. Similar to what higher end Kenwood/Pioneers do.

Blackbandt

abidali But that just confirms what I'm noticing right now. I don't want linear control; I want logarithmic control.

It's simply an uneasy feeling to turn the Dudu up to 30 or more in order to listen at a reasonable volume. Although this might already be the case at volume setting 20. To put it simply, I think this linear regulation is just awful. As I already said, even Joying, Xomax, M.I.C and many other Android radios do it better, or it's normal there.

I also think it's really awful that the Dudu team isn't responding. Even though they're supposed to be taking requests into account. Unfortunately, I'm not seeing any evidence of that. The same applies to the runtime, LPF, and HPF filters, and their improved usability. This slider is still there. You can't perfectly hit 80 or 60Hz.

So, dear Dudu team, what do you say to this? After all, your Dudu7 isn't exactly cheap at €450 in Germany.

Mikescotland

abidali and exactly what we would like back! But no... Dudu knows better than Pioneer, Kenwood, Sony, etc.

Blackbandt

@DUDU-Meng @dudu-lai What do you think? I created a poll in another post. Although there aren't many votes yet, everyone wants logarithmic volume control.

It would be nice if someone would comment on this.

dudu-lai

Blackbandt I'm sorry, I'm not an expert in this area and cannot answer your question.

DUDU-Meng

Blackbandt
This was proposed by audio enthusiasts in the Telegram group. If there's a vote, we'll have to wait and see the results later.

Blackbandt

DUDU-Meng Thank you for your reply.

However, I don't entirely agree with your statement. The problem with the linear volume control is very confusing for me and others as well. No matter which other head unit I had and tested, none of them had the same functionality as the Dudu.

The volume gradually increased on all head units. However, with Dudu, the volume goes from 0 to 10 and then suddenly becomes almost silent, only rising again at the very end. This is also very difficult for people with power amplifiers.

Therefore, if you don't want to change it for everyone, please provide an update file for those who want it changed. That would be a real step in the right direction.

gismo

DUDU-Meng Linear is non-standard and illogical, logarithmic would make adjustments way easier! Decibel is a logarithmic unit; logarithmic volume matches the human ear - so there's a reason why it's standard...
I had trouble to set the gain for my amp, because if I set it to what I'd normally do, I can't adjust lower volumes as gradually as I need...
@Blackbandt where can I find the poll?

Edit: It's here https://forum.dudu-auto.com/d/2731-linear-volume-curve-vs-logarithmic-curve - should be linked in the other threads on volume control also. Or, ideally, all threads would be consolidated but I guess that's a mod task 😉

abidali

Blackbandt I hope volume control should change to logarithmic in upcoming update.

@DUDU-Meng when all other established brands use logarithmic volume when why go for linear? Human hearing perceives sound pressure level changes logarithmically and feels natural to ears and not artificial as in linear. Perhaps by setting it at logarithmic, more efforts should be spent on improving audio experience and adding additional functionality like subwoofer phase adjustment, per channel EQ, ease of crossovers adjustment and time alignment (surround focus) profiles. Your DSP allows even more functionality.

For reference look for Kenwood DMX958XR, which uses older AK7738VQ. They have much more to offer in audio settings.